John
Drama
DATELINE: Jerusalem
Dramatic Dialogue Sermons Lent
Good evening. We continue tonight to investigate the strange circumstances surrounding the death and burial of Jesus of Nazareth. Who was this man? Was he a revolutionary or a prophet? A faithful interpreter of the Holy Scriptures, or a radical with no regard for tradition? And was his body stolen, or was he somehow brought back to life? Joining us tonight, live from Jerusalem, is a man who knew Jesus very closely; the Apostle John, the only member of the group known as "the twelve" who was also witness to the crucifixion of Jesus.
Thank you, John. You are someone I've looked forward to talking with.
You're welcome. Don't end your sentence with a preposition. You want to say "I've looked forward to talking with you."
Right. Sorry.
I don't mean to be rude. It's just that I've been much more aware of words lately.
John, you are perhaps uniquely suited to answer the question millions have been asking. Just who was this Jesus of Nazareth? Or perhaps we should say who "is" this Jesus?
Both of those work. Jesus was; Jesus is. "Will be" works, too. Jesus is a difficult person on which to pin a verb tense.
Because you're not certain whether he is dead or not?
No, not that. I have no doubt about that. I saw him die. I looked at his corpse. Later I saw him alive. He's definitely alive, but he was also definitely dead. Jesus was alive; Jesus is alive. Existed always before; will exist always after. See what I mean? He's kind of hard on grammar.
I see. Well, verb tenses aside, how would you describe Jesus? Prophet, revolutionary, religious conservative, religious radical?
Uh, yes.
What do you mean, "Yes." Those terms are contradictory.
No, they're just not very complete. Jesus was, uh, is definitely a prophet. He spoke the word of God, brought God's will to bear on the real world, here and now, looked ahead to what God is going to do. That's a prophet. But he is/was also a revolutionary. He certainly turns things upside down. He changes how we see power, how we see God, how we see everything.
We have heard reports of his turning tables upside down in the Temple.
Well, that's not exactly what I had in mind, but, yes, he did do that.
We understand that it was a very public display of anger, for no apparent reason. Perhaps you could explain, for the benefit of our viewers, why Jesus engaged in such an act of vandalism.
It was a statement. Everything that Jesus did said something. It's almost as if you were listening to his actions rather than watching them. Yes, he was very angry, but he had a reason to be. I would hardly call what he did vandalism. He was acting against activities that had no place in the Temple.
For our non-Jewish viewers, let me clarify. Worship at the Temple often includes animal sacrifices. The animals to be sacrificed must first be inspected by priests, and can be refused if the animal has even the slightest imperfection. Therefore, to save someone bringing an animal hundreds of miles, only to be told at the last minute that the animal is unusable, pre-approved animals are sold in the temple courtyard. There are even kiosks set up where a foreign traveler could convert his currency into temple coin.
That was a little wordy, but accurate.
And Jesus attacked the legitimate businessmen, who were working with full approval of the temple authorities.
As I said before, it was a statement. It wasn't about whether or not the people selling doves had a vending license. It was about people getting caught up in silly regulations and fixating on whether someone's goat had a pimple on its left ear, instead of focusing on the glory of God. People were trying to buy off God, and these so-called legitimate businessmen were encouraging this nonsense.
So it was an attack on the temple practices as much as an attack on the merchants?
Yes. It wasn't about goats or buildings, or exchange rates; it was always about true worship, and hearing the word of God.
But Jesus threatened to destroy the Temple itself.
Jesus is not Osama Bin-Laden. He wasn't going to blow anything up.
The quote was, I believe, "Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up." Are you saying that Jesus has been misquoted?
No, he said it all right. I've been thinking a great deal about that these past few days, actually, and I've come to believe that he wasn't really talking about the Temple.
"Destroy this temple, and in ..."
(Interrupting) I know the quote. But the temple he was talking about wasn't Jerusalem's number one tourist attraction. He was talking about himself. The temple of his body. It was destroyed, but in three days, God raised him up again.
Jesus was comparing himself to the Temple?
Yes, I believe so. It makes sense. The Temple was where people would go to meet God. But all that's changed now. This is a way in which Jesus is truly revolutionary. Heaven and earth don't meet in some architectural wonder downtown here. Heaven and earth meet in Jesus.
That's quite a claim.
I realize that. But it's true. It's who Jesus is.
And that brings us back to our original question: Who is, or was, Jesus of Nazareth?
I've been developing this fascination for words lately, as I mentioned before. I've been trying to remember things that Jesus said, both verbally and in his actions. I've been writing little lists of things. Maybe someday I'll write it all down, although I don't think I could ever really get it all. If the whole world were just one big library, it still wouldn't be big enough to hold everything. One of the lists I've been making is a list of ways that Jesus answered that question.
What Jesus said about who he is?
Yes. That would probably be the best way to answer your question.
Do you have the list with you?
I do. Your producer here insisted on typing it into the tele-prompter, but that's not really necessary. I know them all by heart.
Very well, then. Who did Jesus say „ who does he say „ that he is? Uh, that he was?
See, he's just hard on grammar.
You're telling me.
Some of these he said over and over, at different times, worded slightly differently. I'll skip over the more repetitive ones.
Thank you.
Well, he said, "I am the Messiah."
Messiah.
From the Hebrew, Meshiach. Christos in Greek. You would say something like, oil-smeared or anointed. It means God's chosen person.
Okay.
Then, "I am the Bread of Life."
He's bread?
He's what you need to keep going. He's God's way of taking care of us. Sometimes he put it, "I am the living bread come down from heaven."
Very interesting.
More than interesting. This isn't just academic. This is the meaning of life we're talking about here.
Of course. Please go on.
"I am the light of the world."
Light of the world?
Jesus, that is, not me.
I understand.
Jesus makes it so we can see what's really going on, what really matters. Let's see. He also says, "I am the one who testifies for myself."
What does that mean?
That only Jesus can truly define who Jesus is. It's because of that one that I'm reading this list to you. We can't put Jesus into a pigeonhole. He's so far beyond anything else in human experience. "I am the good Shepherd" and "I am the gate of the sheepfold."
I'm not clear on the "gate"aone.
Jesus gathers God's people, protects them, and keeps them together like a shepherd.
That makes it sound as if Jesus is claiming to be God.
He gets more to the point. Listen to these: "I am from above" and "I am not of this world." "I am the way, the truth, and the life." "I am the resurrection and the life." "I am in the Father." "I am the Son of God." "I am ..."
Uh, John, in the interest of time, could you just pick one of these sayings that, in your mind, best sums up who Jesus is?
Out of the things that he said?
Yes, if you would please.
I am.
(Pause) I'm sorry, John, we seem to be having some trouble with the transmission, we didn't hear the end of that last sentence.
That's it, just "I am."
That's sort of obvious, don't you think?
Yes, I think so. But you'd be surprised how many people don't catch that one.
Don't catch what?
Oh, I'm sorry, I just assumed ... You know, when God spoke to Moses out of the burning bush?
Yes?
Well, Moses asked God what his name was, who he should say had sent him, and God said, "I am who I am. Tell them that 'I am' has sent you."
So Jesus is saying that he is God?
He is.
But what are you saying about him? You have reported what Jesus said of himself. What do you think? Who would you say that Jesus is?
I said before that only Jesus can truly define who Jesus is. Nothing I could say would really be adequate. There will always be more to Jesus than I could tell you, but since you insist, I'll take a crack at it. I've become fascinated with words of late, and here's why. Jesus is the Word of God.
How is that possible?
I have no idea. But it's true. In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was in the beginning with God; all things were made through him, and without him was not anything made that was made. In him was life. And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us. That's who Jesus is.
Thank you, John. I don't know if that makes things any clearer, but you've certainly given us something to think about.
You're welcome. I hope you do think about it. I hope your audience does, too. Peace be with you.
Live from Jerusalem, that was the Apostle John. Our interview with John was to be the last in this series of conversations about the crucifixion of Jesus. But we have just received word this afternoon of an informant within the Roman military who promises, in his words, to "blow the lid off" the conflicting claims made by the followers of Jesus and the empire. Join us next week on Dateline: Jerusalem.
Thank you, John. You are someone I've looked forward to talking with.
You're welcome. Don't end your sentence with a preposition. You want to say "I've looked forward to talking with you."
Right. Sorry.
I don't mean to be rude. It's just that I've been much more aware of words lately.
John, you are perhaps uniquely suited to answer the question millions have been asking. Just who was this Jesus of Nazareth? Or perhaps we should say who "is" this Jesus?
Both of those work. Jesus was; Jesus is. "Will be" works, too. Jesus is a difficult person on which to pin a verb tense.
Because you're not certain whether he is dead or not?
No, not that. I have no doubt about that. I saw him die. I looked at his corpse. Later I saw him alive. He's definitely alive, but he was also definitely dead. Jesus was alive; Jesus is alive. Existed always before; will exist always after. See what I mean? He's kind of hard on grammar.
I see. Well, verb tenses aside, how would you describe Jesus? Prophet, revolutionary, religious conservative, religious radical?
Uh, yes.
What do you mean, "Yes." Those terms are contradictory.
No, they're just not very complete. Jesus was, uh, is definitely a prophet. He spoke the word of God, brought God's will to bear on the real world, here and now, looked ahead to what God is going to do. That's a prophet. But he is/was also a revolutionary. He certainly turns things upside down. He changes how we see power, how we see God, how we see everything.
We have heard reports of his turning tables upside down in the Temple.
Well, that's not exactly what I had in mind, but, yes, he did do that.
We understand that it was a very public display of anger, for no apparent reason. Perhaps you could explain, for the benefit of our viewers, why Jesus engaged in such an act of vandalism.
It was a statement. Everything that Jesus did said something. It's almost as if you were listening to his actions rather than watching them. Yes, he was very angry, but he had a reason to be. I would hardly call what he did vandalism. He was acting against activities that had no place in the Temple.
For our non-Jewish viewers, let me clarify. Worship at the Temple often includes animal sacrifices. The animals to be sacrificed must first be inspected by priests, and can be refused if the animal has even the slightest imperfection. Therefore, to save someone bringing an animal hundreds of miles, only to be told at the last minute that the animal is unusable, pre-approved animals are sold in the temple courtyard. There are even kiosks set up where a foreign traveler could convert his currency into temple coin.
That was a little wordy, but accurate.
And Jesus attacked the legitimate businessmen, who were working with full approval of the temple authorities.
As I said before, it was a statement. It wasn't about whether or not the people selling doves had a vending license. It was about people getting caught up in silly regulations and fixating on whether someone's goat had a pimple on its left ear, instead of focusing on the glory of God. People were trying to buy off God, and these so-called legitimate businessmen were encouraging this nonsense.
So it was an attack on the temple practices as much as an attack on the merchants?
Yes. It wasn't about goats or buildings, or exchange rates; it was always about true worship, and hearing the word of God.
But Jesus threatened to destroy the Temple itself.
Jesus is not Osama Bin-Laden. He wasn't going to blow anything up.
The quote was, I believe, "Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up." Are you saying that Jesus has been misquoted?
No, he said it all right. I've been thinking a great deal about that these past few days, actually, and I've come to believe that he wasn't really talking about the Temple.
"Destroy this temple, and in ..."
(Interrupting) I know the quote. But the temple he was talking about wasn't Jerusalem's number one tourist attraction. He was talking about himself. The temple of his body. It was destroyed, but in three days, God raised him up again.
Jesus was comparing himself to the Temple?
Yes, I believe so. It makes sense. The Temple was where people would go to meet God. But all that's changed now. This is a way in which Jesus is truly revolutionary. Heaven and earth don't meet in some architectural wonder downtown here. Heaven and earth meet in Jesus.
That's quite a claim.
I realize that. But it's true. It's who Jesus is.
And that brings us back to our original question: Who is, or was, Jesus of Nazareth?
I've been developing this fascination for words lately, as I mentioned before. I've been trying to remember things that Jesus said, both verbally and in his actions. I've been writing little lists of things. Maybe someday I'll write it all down, although I don't think I could ever really get it all. If the whole world were just one big library, it still wouldn't be big enough to hold everything. One of the lists I've been making is a list of ways that Jesus answered that question.
What Jesus said about who he is?
Yes. That would probably be the best way to answer your question.
Do you have the list with you?
I do. Your producer here insisted on typing it into the tele-prompter, but that's not really necessary. I know them all by heart.
Very well, then. Who did Jesus say „ who does he say „ that he is? Uh, that he was?
See, he's just hard on grammar.
You're telling me.
Some of these he said over and over, at different times, worded slightly differently. I'll skip over the more repetitive ones.
Thank you.
Well, he said, "I am the Messiah."
Messiah.
From the Hebrew, Meshiach. Christos in Greek. You would say something like, oil-smeared or anointed. It means God's chosen person.
Okay.
Then, "I am the Bread of Life."
He's bread?
He's what you need to keep going. He's God's way of taking care of us. Sometimes he put it, "I am the living bread come down from heaven."
Very interesting.
More than interesting. This isn't just academic. This is the meaning of life we're talking about here.
Of course. Please go on.
"I am the light of the world."
Light of the world?
Jesus, that is, not me.
I understand.
Jesus makes it so we can see what's really going on, what really matters. Let's see. He also says, "I am the one who testifies for myself."
What does that mean?
That only Jesus can truly define who Jesus is. It's because of that one that I'm reading this list to you. We can't put Jesus into a pigeonhole. He's so far beyond anything else in human experience. "I am the good Shepherd" and "I am the gate of the sheepfold."
I'm not clear on the "gate"aone.
Jesus gathers God's people, protects them, and keeps them together like a shepherd.
That makes it sound as if Jesus is claiming to be God.
He gets more to the point. Listen to these: "I am from above" and "I am not of this world." "I am the way, the truth, and the life." "I am the resurrection and the life." "I am in the Father." "I am the Son of God." "I am ..."
Uh, John, in the interest of time, could you just pick one of these sayings that, in your mind, best sums up who Jesus is?
Out of the things that he said?
Yes, if you would please.
I am.
(Pause) I'm sorry, John, we seem to be having some trouble with the transmission, we didn't hear the end of that last sentence.
That's it, just "I am."
That's sort of obvious, don't you think?
Yes, I think so. But you'd be surprised how many people don't catch that one.
Don't catch what?
Oh, I'm sorry, I just assumed ... You know, when God spoke to Moses out of the burning bush?
Yes?
Well, Moses asked God what his name was, who he should say had sent him, and God said, "I am who I am. Tell them that 'I am' has sent you."
So Jesus is saying that he is God?
He is.
But what are you saying about him? You have reported what Jesus said of himself. What do you think? Who would you say that Jesus is?
I said before that only Jesus can truly define who Jesus is. Nothing I could say would really be adequate. There will always be more to Jesus than I could tell you, but since you insist, I'll take a crack at it. I've become fascinated with words of late, and here's why. Jesus is the Word of God.
How is that possible?
I have no idea. But it's true. In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was in the beginning with God; all things were made through him, and without him was not anything made that was made. In him was life. And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us. That's who Jesus is.
Thank you, John. I don't know if that makes things any clearer, but you've certainly given us something to think about.
You're welcome. I hope you do think about it. I hope your audience does, too. Peace be with you.
Live from Jerusalem, that was the Apostle John. Our interview with John was to be the last in this series of conversations about the crucifixion of Jesus. But we have just received word this afternoon of an informant within the Roman military who promises, in his words, to "blow the lid off" the conflicting claims made by the followers of Jesus and the empire. Join us next week on Dateline: Jerusalem.
